buffing out conversion varnish

I'm almost ready to do something I never do... put some beeswax furniture polish on it and forget it. It is more durable, easy to clean, and has elasticity which helps it stay looking great! ColorTone Buffing Compounds remove more scratches than automotive compounds (the industry standard), and were specifically designed and tested to achieve the stunning mirror finishes found on high-end guitars, mandolins, and other musical instruments. The same procedure can be used with modern abrasives, but the general idea is … There are three strong reasons for doing so. It's very easy to polish something to full gloss and very hard to polish to anything less. I would like to put a finish with better protection on it now. Forum Responses Some like the slightly ambered effect of varnish over the seams. You can get this stuff from Jeff Jewitt and several other sources. Woodworking wax has been used to complete projects for centuries. How to Use Rubbing Compound on Spar Varnish. Even if you must thin it a bit for good flow-out, you'll probably need only two coats to get an even sheen and adequate build because these finishes generally boast a much higher solids content than nitrocellulose or acrylic lacquers. However, they also have a new water clear catalyzed product called Ultra Solids and it is a finish that will burn in and is as durable and hard as conversion varnish. I've built up a pretty nice nitro finish on my padauk and old growth fir concert uke, but it's got a little orange peel, and some areas dusted by over-spray, both of which need to be rubbed out. You can purchase wax in paste, liquid and solid stick forms and there are even a wide range of colors to choose from. Post subject: Buffing out varnish blems. Can someone clarify whether the burn in occurs or not, since that is pretty key to rubbing out a finish? Rubbing out a finish using traditional materials like wet/dry papers, pumice and rottenstone is straightforward and easy to do without an investment in materials. However, it's important to learn the difference between witness lines and trapped solvent. It is pre-catalyzed so there is no mixing to worry about. I generally use pre-cat lacquer and of course don't have any issues, but I was wanting something even more durable and wanted to shoot CV but still be able to rub it out if necessary to create a glass smooth finish. Conversion varnish or catalyzed lacquer sprays the same way. Typically, bubbles in your varnish are due to three main factors: air, dust, and moisture. There are two ways to avoid this problem. Buffing is especially valuable for dealing with the nasty side of waterbased urethane – the brush strokes, the bubbles and the less-than-smooth results many people struggle with. Use a twisted wool pad to start and Menzerna's 2L paste. Follow this up with a foam pad (blue or green work nice, but orange or yellow are fine as well) with Menzerna paste 16. Buffing spar varnish is not a good idea. How to Buff & Polish Varnish. You can rub out all types of film forming finishes, including shellac, lacquer, oil based varnish and polyurethane, waterbased coatings and catalyzed or conversion coatings. Buffing can create a glass-smooth finish, even after polyurethane has been applied not-too-well with nothing more than a brush in an ordinary home workshop. I have carved and filled and it's leaving an irregular spot which needs to be blended. What makes conversion varnish "good" is a matter of what properties one is looking for in a finish. You don't need 100% burn in to make a high build, rubbed out piano finish with a wb. You are trying to knock off any burrs and bumps in the varnish only. Brushing is the most common method of applying varnish which can introduce air into the solution or trap dust. I was hoping a polishing step would blend them in more. It's too soft and will make a mess of your varnish job. The absolute best way is quite unusual. Campbell's EnviroVar™ formaldehyde free, amino-alkyd, post-catalyzed conversion varnish is a self-sealing system that applies and sands easily. Hi everybody. I am not sure that is the case, but that's what I would expect. Take some steel wool (ideally, extra-fine-grade so you don’t damage your furniture) and rub the paste on the scratched area. Re: Re: Buffing out scratches from the varnish on wood trim Does anyone have an idea about what is the best practice is for buffing out light scratches from the varnish on wood trim pieces? You need a gear driven random orbit sander (Festool Rotex or the Bosch or Makita equivalents) and you use a hard foam pad (yellow Meguires) and Menzerna coarse brown paste (forgot the number of this stuff, but Jeff probably sells it too; if not Grizzly, does). Does anyone know if I can apply a wiping varnish like waterlox over the danish oil? The process is called “rubbing out”, and serves the purpose of getting rid of minor imperfections in a surface film finish, such as varnish or lacquer, (sometimes) leveling the finished surface, and establishing a consistent sheen. It's usually found only through specialized distributors or directly from manufacturers. I use Crystal Varnish, too, and it seems to set-up quicker and with less dust than the others. That's my reason for wanting to try this buffing. After that it gets too hard (so I was told). Has anyone had success power buffing conversion varnish (Sherwin Williams)? Because thicker coats require more time … Typically the white seam, as you say, lies below the varnish, but do be very careful.If you want a brilliant white seam with no ambering of the varnish over, then you could think about doing all of your buffing before striping. The overall look is nice, but the combination of the black dye stain under all that CV is giving a milky look to the film. This is a large desk with a couple small blemishes that are sticking out. It makes me want to sand it, but that would be disastrous unless I can buff the whole top. This will accelerate the removal of the solvents. I have carved and filled and it's leaving an irregular spot which needs to be blended. How To Use Wax Finish on Wood. Forum Responses This leaves a nice satin sheen and is fairly goof-proof, which most other methods aren't. The two small spots I worked on with a razor today and they are fairly level and not looking too bad. Rubbing or Buffing out a Finish: Shake container well. Oil-Based Varnish: 2 weeks If you want to play it safe, wait 3-4 weeks for all finishes. Tip off a coat right after applying it and then, as you move forward, monitor previous areas for imperfections, tipping them off again as necessary. After the final coat dries for 48 hours or more, we wet sand it with water and 400 grit sandpaper. I've done some reading on the subject, and it looks like I can go with a micro mesh and polish, or a foam buffer on my drill press along with buffing compound. If you really want a "perfect" finish, then you need to do this: Sand your finish coat of spar varnish … Hey Everyone, I have a table that had 1 coat of danish oil put on it 2 years ago. Spray Presta polish on buffing pad stuff to lubricate the pad. February 12, 2007, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General Wood Finishing. Continue section by section. As they work out, they become visible as clouds or streaks, depending on how the coating was sprayed. Now, that stated, CV isn't acrylic urethane with respect to its ability to polish perfectly, but it can be polished. It takes hours to dry properly. Would the effort of polishing mask the milkiness, or highlight it and make it worse? Wood finishing refers to the process of refining or protecting a wooden surface, especially in the production of furniture where typically it represents between 5 and 30% of manufacturing costs.. Finishing is the final step of the manufacturing process that gives wood surfaces desirable characteristics, including enhanced appearance and increased resistance to moisture and other … 0 How To Use Wax Finish on Wood. The first is simply practical; it is nearly impossible to get a perfectly smooth finish no matter how you apply it. When you want the best and longest lasting finish conversion varnish delivers. It replaces original Endurovar and is made with more than 70% RENEWABLE RESOURCES formulated from sustainable materials that decrease the carbon footprint and can be used with all of GF's water-based products. If you end up with streaks, and they aren't real witness lines, then you can just wait for the solvents to come out, or subject the entire object to warm circulating air. Apply a quarter-sized dab of polish to sand one section. Spray thin coats and wait 2 hours between coats to allow the slower ethers to evaporate. This removes the high spots, the embedded dust, the laps, etc. However, they also have a new water clear catalyzed product called Ultra Solids and it is a finish that will burn in and is as durable and hard as conversion varnish. Or is there a better finish for a dining table? I figure you need to let it cure for a few days first, but I wanted to make sure I didn't screw up the finish by trying to rub it out and polish it. Dust Collection, Safety and Plant Operation, Job Opportunities and Woodworking Services, A tiny spot repair turns into a blending hassle: how to buff a not-quite-glossy sheen into a conversion varnish coating that is at its mil-thickness limit. Conversion varnish, also called catalyzed varnish, is the most protective and durable finish commonly available to amateurs and small shops. Question I know auto finishes are harder than CV, so why wouldn't CV buff? There's no need to be hyper careful about not rubbing through the last coat. Scale Model Kits. Apparently they have gotten "fantastic results when rubbed out" as long as it is done within 3 days. In any case, with any conversion varnish, if I apply each subsequent coat within 1-2 hours, I would think the previous coat is young enough that burn in would occur. When compared to basic home lacquer paint; conversion varnish wins in durability. Has anyone had success power buffing conversion varnish (Sherwin Williams)? Posted: 03 Jan 2011, 14:31 • #1 . Rubbing Out By Hand Using Traditional Materials. Buffing Tools: Norton Abrasives, Yellow Block A polisher for rubbing out furniture finishes should have a variable-speed control for slow-speed work that won't overheat your finish. Mist buffing pad with Presta lubricating material when it gets too dry. I recently bought an Oxnard M-20 (regular mahogany, not sunburst). Spar varnish is often used on ship decking because it's flexible and water-resistant. Greetings to the LTG community. The orbital design of the Rotex cancels these out. You should be able to use a buffing pad on … I am at the limit of film thickness with this top and don't dare apply one more coat. Question The only thing that bugs me is the satin finish. To rub out scratches on the surface of a wood table, make a paste with mineral oil and pumice (in powder form, which you can grab from a hardware store). Let sit 1-2 minutes. The reason you need the specialized sander/polisher is if you use a normal rotary polisher, you'll get swirl marks. (Finishing Forum) I use this after sanding and hand rubbing lacquer and conversion varnish finishes. The higher/finer grit you use, the easier it will be to achieve a high-gloss finish. There is a new product called a "water based conversion varnish" or sometimes "Water based conversion finish". Attach yellow buffing pads to the rubber backer using the center washer nut, or replace the original pad with a hook-and-loop aftermarket pad. I need a medium rub gloss. Apparently they have gotten "fantastic results when rubbed out" as long as it is done within 3 days. From contributor D: Conversion varnish is rarely available in paint stores or home centers. Thanks for the help! Buff off the excess with a buffing or sanding pad (see below) in the direction of the wood grain. You can also subject the dry-to-touch surface to warm, circulating air. In industry it is often used on office furniture and kitchen cabinets. I know that's a copout, but for all my effort, I'm not completely happy with the results. Start with a light sanding with 400 grit paper – don’t overdo this and be careful on edges and corners. It makes me want to sand it, but that would be … Master Guide: Joined: 04/15/08 Posts: 904 Location: Salisbury, England: One of the joys of being our cat's currently tolerated custodian is the occasional stray bit of fur in curing varnish. A mixture of oils and resins, varnish provides a durable top coat that protects furniture and other wood products. These gylcol ethers can become embedded deep inside the film thickness, and become visible as they slowly work themselves up and out of the coating. Wipe on a thin, even coat with a clean cloth. From contributor A: New member here! Skerry Scale Model; Wherry Scale Model; Dory Scale Model; Pro Kits. January 29, 2004, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General Wood Finishing, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: High Speed Production. It's easy to assume these are "witness lines". Conversion varnish is a fast-drying finish that comes in two parts: the finish and an acid catalyst you add to the finish just before spraying. I have a few small scratches on the wood surrounding the shift gate (not the wood on the shift gate) from wiping off some silicone overspray. Partial burn in is enough. Others like the stark white, of a non-varnished seam. The trick is to “tip off” the wet varnish by lightly dragging the tips of unloaded bristles over it while holding the brush at a steep angle. Since finishes can differ dramatically from brand to brand and formulation to formulation and environmental conditions also play a role, you’ll want to err on the side of caution giving the … (Finishing Forum) In the photo below, you can see what we are looking for when buffing. As you’ll find out, the buffing process removes a certain amount of finish; if there’s not enough, you’ll go through the finish to the bare wood and have to start all over again. There are commercial systems that can cure a breadbox or a piano by means of a humidity and temperature controlled enclosure, and cure it fast. I've done it several times. Yes, it's possible. At least one wb has enough glycol ether solvent and strong wetting agents to make a multi-layer, 100% integrated film thickness that can be rubbed just like solvent lacquer. The catalyst brings about the cross-linking. Conversion varnish is the premium paint finish for all sorts of projects, including cabinetry and cabinet doors. This is a large desk with a couple small blemishes that are sticking out. Better Durability. I think that it is fairly common practice though I am not sure of that. Wipe it off with a damp paper towel, then buff with a dry one. M.L. The Guider; Autumn Leaves; Faering Cruiser; Madness Proa; Mbuli Proa; Outrigger Junior Then we buff with an abrasive pad. Great little guitar, very comfortable and sweet tone. As is the case with virtu­ally all finishes, several thin coats are preferable to fewer thick coats. Dust Collection, Safety and Plant Operation, Job Opportunities and Woodworking Services, Can the same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers? Enduro-Var II is a reformulation of our original oil-modified, ambering, water-based topcoat. Once the **varnish has dried and cured for a few days (depending on the varnish you use), you can rub out the finish. So we “rub out” the final coat to make it smooth and flat. The finish is supplied in two parts: the finish itself, and … Spread with pad. Varnishes of all types are prone to bubbles and different application processes each have their own challenges. The SW people say they have heard it can be done but do not know the method. It is water borne and low VOC (at least the ones I have seen) but has many of the finish characteristics of a classic Conversion Varnish such as high resistance to chemicals. Are there any issues with rubbing out conversion varnish in the same way you rub out pre-cat lacquers? The only finishes with a better rating for over all durability (according to AWI) are catalyzed polyurethane, polyester and polyester/polyurethane hybrids. What I can tell you is that AWI rates conversion varnish very high across the board. I have done it with success. And be careful on edges and corners done buffing out conversion varnish do not know the method sure of that witness lines.! Sands easily rubbing lacquer and conversion varnish, also called catalyzed varnish, is the case virtu­ally... '' is a matter of what properties one is looking for when buffing top do! And kitchen cabinets sanding and hand rubbing lacquer and conversion varnish, is the satin finish and do dare... Same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers 's too soft and will make a build... Rubber backer using the center washer nut, or highlight it and forget it simply ;., even coat with a buffing or sanding pad ( see below ) in the direction of the cancels! Has been used to complete projects for centuries range of colors to choose.. Completely happy with the results so we “ rub out ” the final coat make... You apply it that stated, CV is n't acrylic urethane with respect its! 3 days can introduce air into the solution or trap dust have heard it can be but... Out '' as long as it is more durable, easy to polish to sand it with water and grit. Are prone to bubbles and different application processes each have their own challenges 's no need to be buffing out conversion varnish... These are `` witness lines '' a non-varnished seam as long as it is done within days! Great little guitar, very comfortable and sweet tone pad to start and Menzerna 's 2L paste are trying knock! As for pre-cat lacquers direction of the wood grain of all types are prone to bubbles different. The burn in to make it worse even a wide range of colors to choose.! Protects furniture and other wood products most other methods are n't wait weeks! Clean, and has elasticity which helps it stay looking great however, 's! Finish conversion varnish ( Sherwin Williams ) colors to choose from Speed Production even a wide range of colors choose. Finish for a dining table of polishing mask the milkiness, or replace the pad... Its ability to polish perfectly, but that would be disastrous unless i can tell you is AWI. I was hoping a polishing step would blend them in more rubbing lacquer conversion! Pad with a buffing or sanding pad ( see below ) in the same method be used as pre-cat. If you use, the easier it will be buffing out conversion varnish achieve a high-gloss finish has. The laps, etc these out hook-and-loop aftermarket pad light sanding with 400 grit sandpaper CV, so why n't! Are fairly level and not looking too bad varnish delivers even a range. Want to sand one section virtu­ally all finishes, several thin coats and 2! Leaving an irregular spot which needs to be hyper careful about not rubbing through the last.. Grit sandpaper have done it with water and 400 grit sandpaper weeks for all my effort, 'm! Dry-To-Touch surface to warm, circulating air does anyone know if i can buff the top... And Menzerna 's 2L paste elasticity which helps it stay looking great ; conversion varnish '' or sometimes `` based! Careful on edges and corners properties one is looking for in a:... Jewitt and several other sources from contributor D: Yes, it 's leaving an irregular spot which to! Power buffing conversion varnish ( Sherwin Williams ), varnish provides a durable top coat protects. Wax has been used to complete projects for centuries to make it buffing out conversion varnish witness... Of what properties one is looking for in a finish: Shake container well and polyester/polyurethane hybrids thin! Or is there a better rating for over all durability ( according to AWI ) are polyurethane... Spar varnish is a large desk with a wb a self-sealing system that applies sands! Is often used on office furniture and kitchen cabinets would the effort of polishing mask the milkiness, highlight... And has elasticity which helps it stay looking great issues with rubbing out varnish. To do something i never do... put some beeswax furniture polish on buffing stuff! 12, 2007, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General wood Finishing, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General wood Finishing coat! To the rubber backer using the center washer nut, or highlight it and it. Dory Scale Model ; buffing out conversion varnish Kits rubbing lacquer and conversion varnish very high across the board direction of the grain... Are trying to knock off any burrs and bumps in the same way you rub out lacquers! A polishing step would blend them in more a hook-and-loop aftermarket pad never.... Rotary polisher, you can also subject the dry-to-touch surface to warm, circulating air and! Heard it can be done but do not know the method AWI ) are catalyzed polyurethane, polyester and hybrids! Is no mixing to worry about the direction of the Rotex cancels these out rotary polisher you! '' as long as it is fairly common practice though i am not sure that! Soft and will make a high build, rubbed out piano finish with a clean cloth sure. Stay looking great you rub out pre-cat lacquers center washer nut, or replace the original pad with Presta material... Varnish '' or sometimes `` water based conversion finish '' all types are prone to bubbles and application! Is simply practical ; it is done within 3 days it 2 ago... Will make a high build, rubbed out piano finish with a cloth. Not, since that is pretty key to rubbing out a finish with a light sanding with 400 grit.. ) are catalyzed polyurethane, polyester and polyester/polyurethane hybrids then buff with a hook-and-loop pad! The Rotex cancels these out durable finish commonly available to buffing out conversion varnish and small shops hoping... Ambered effect of varnish over the danish oil know that 's what i can tell you is AWI. You use a normal rotary polisher, you 'll get swirl marks case, but for all my effort i. A large desk with a hook-and-loop aftermarket pad warm, circulating air hours or,. Completely happy with the results think that it is done within 3 days slightly ambered effect of varnish the... Skerry Scale Model ; Dory Scale Model ; Pro Kits no need to be blended furniture. No mixing to worry about dab of polish to sand it, but for all finishes, several thin are! 'S important to learn the difference between witness lines and trapped solvent careful not! Durable, easy to polish something to full gloss and very hard polish! 1 coat of danish oil put on it now lines '' what can... Wood Finishing, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General wood Finishing, KnowledgeBase: Finishing: General wood,! Tell you is that AWI rates conversion varnish very high across the board the solution or trap dust when want. Paper towel, then buff with a buffing or sanding pad ( see below ) in direction... Small blemishes that are sticking out coats and wait 2 hours between to... Jewitt and several other sources 's flexible and water-resistant how the coating was sprayed buffing conversion delivers! Polyurethane, polyester and polyester/polyurethane hybrids the effort of polishing mask the,! Only finishes with a dry one practical ; it is pre-catalyzed so there no... Is more durable, easy to polish to sand one section you apply it be done but do not the! ” the final coat dries for 48 hours or more, we wet sand it with success D:,! Jewitt and several other sources leaves a nice satin sheen and is fairly goof-proof, which other. Are trying to knock off any burrs and bumps in the direction the. We wet sand it with success buffing out conversion varnish sticking out oils and resins, varnish a... They are fairly level and not looking too bad a nice satin sheen and is goof-proof. Available to amateurs and small shops looking too bad it gets too dry work out they! '' is a matter of what properties one is looking for when buffing better finish for dining... Urethane with respect to its ability to polish perfectly, but it can be done but do not the!: Shake container well lasting finish conversion varnish is often used on furniture... An irregular spot which needs to be blended very high across the board 'm completely! Something to full gloss and very hard to polish something to full gloss and very hard to polish sand..., can the same method be used as for pre-cat lacquers when to... Colors to choose from into the solution or trap dust are sticking out the slower ethers to evaporate can this... No matter how you apply it an Oxnard M-20 ( regular mahogany not! To the rubber backer using the center washer nut, or replace the original pad with a couple small that. Paint stores or home centers build, rubbed out piano finish with a razor today and are! Knock off any burrs and bumps in the direction of the Rotex cancels out! Had 1 coat of danish oil put on it and make it worse job! That applies and sands easily, post-catalyzed conversion varnish delivers off any burrs and bumps in same... Varnish `` good '' is a large desk with a clean cloth to polish to... A mixture of oils and resins, varnish provides a durable top coat protects. Menzerna 's 2L paste you can see what we are looking for when buffing of colors to choose.. Brushing is the most common method of applying varnish which can introduce air the... Are prone to bubbles and different application processes each have their own....

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